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Teresa

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Reply with quote  #76 

Couldn't agree with you more Jennifer!


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rwatsonaz

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Reply with quote  #77 

Well I think we have Filet'd that subject pretty well.  Anyone for a game of Cribbage?


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Teresa

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Reply with quote  #78 

I played Cribbage 100 years ago, but have forgotten how. How about a good game of Poker or Chess!


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alwcm4

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Reply with quote  #79 

LOL, I'm more of a Chutes n' Ladders kind of girl!


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Amanda
VonSchiedelEnglishMastiff

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Reply with quote  #80 
Wow! I am now horrible because I haven't had the time to look at this drama page. Please give it a rest. I have taken your beatings and tried to be constructive with the criticism I have received.  I have in time made modifications brought to my attention on the web site, for which i have little time to deal with either. Working on it, when I can. Lots of pages are old pages with old information, updating and deleting were needed as time permits. I spend my time with my pups and their training, that you don't believe in, instead of sitting here at this board. Lets get something clear I started with 1 male and 2 females. I kept some of their pups and bought another male to bred to them. I never claimed to be some big kennel.  Von Schiedel i understood to mean Shield in German, so I named my starting Mastiff  line in my mind a "Shield" Against Abuse Hoping in some crazy way it would detour further abuse in my life, yet it seems to be drawing the abuse. My family has breed several breeds in the last 30 years, not just mastiffs. If any of you checked with AKC you would find I haven't bred my dogs any sooner then 2 years apart, after they turned 2. The dogs I bred, parents' were certified (Van Houtens through ofa) and they have had no more then 2 liters and are retired. Their daughters just became old enough to breed and I have had 1 liter from 2 daughters.  That is it, for the mastiffs breeding. I sell with limited rights so that no puppies are breed. I have given full rights to 2 dogs, people who wanted to show only. I only want that from dawn to abide by our contract that puppies are not to be bred and are limited registration. I am well aware shell never comply with payment she contractually committed to. When I sign for the stud papers and she get full rights for the pups you will see who scammed who. These pups should not be bred and she knows it. I'm no pro, never claimed to be. All this started because some lady ran her mouth with a bunch of lies, to take the blame off of her planned scam, and you all fell into a bandwagon of bashing me. People (satisfied customers came to my defense and you deleted their posts and banned them. Making me/ my hobby breeding and my dogs the victims of Bashing and drug through the mud. How can you say what i claim is a lie. I have customers who didn't believe and were proven wrong after dealing with my dogs, found I was completely honest. My puppies are very well started on their obedience and potty trained. I posted the pedigrees showing ten generations back on the dogs. Their will not be von schiedel in ofa, evidence of this can be scene on my site if you look. As far as other entities that i am affiliated with. New Hope T.E.C. Inc. the 501c3 org i founded and directed for 12 years, has been closed for 3 years. That is posted if you look as well. I'm selling my dogs, the way the breeder I bought from advised me. I understand you ran him through the mud too. If my stock is so bad why do people want it so bad? Why would this lady start all this mess? unless she was trying to take the light of her scam off of herself. Why do you care so much about little ol me am I that threatening to you? All it takes is a good hearted person to say "hey you have great intentions here, but you might want to change a few things." and people would be more receptive to your recommendations for the proper way to breed. Seems the new guy gets squeezed out/ bullied out. You can assume all you want I will not look at this page ever again, so feel free to Make yourself look like a fool by continuing this high school drama. Grow Up,  Do Your Homework, Pick on someone your own size Please!

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Walk a Mile in my shoes, see what I see, feel what I feel, THEN maybe you'll understand why I do what I do, till then don't judge me.Proverbs 6:16-19
There are six things that the Lord hates, seven that are an abomination to him: haughty eyes, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked plans, feet that make haste to run to evil, a false witness who breathes out lies, and one who sows discord among brothers.
Ephesians 4:25
Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another.
Teresa

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Reply with quote  #81 

Quote:
People (satisfied customers came to my defense and you deleted their posts and banned them.
THis is false. The only one banned was the dude that went WAY out there and compared those of us to care to the "Nazi" mindset. How ridiculous.
Quote:
I understand you ran him through the mud too.
NO clue who you are talking about, so clearly we have not run him through the mud.  
Quote:
Seems the new guy gets squeezed out/ bullied out.
Second, I'm one of the smallest breeders around. I am fairly new myself, but have WORKED at learning and doing things BY THE BOOK for the betterment of the breed. Finally, I've give you every opportunity to answer my questions and you've skirted them. (Please go back and look if you'd like to see which ones). My goal is not to bully anyone (that's why you've are welcome to defend yourself), but only to allow light to be shown on breeders with questionable issues. If you are truly doing what is best for the breed (and puppy buyers), then you are very free to make that clear. So far, you have not.
I just took a moment to look up Van Houton testing...2 dogs tested and neither with hips or elbows. ONE female tested for thyroid and PRA; the other tested for several things but not hips/elbows.
I have not deleted any post and only banned one because he/she was not adding any information but just hurling insults. As you see, you are still free to post rebuttals.

Finally, if Dawn should NOT sell her pups because they aren't quality enough, then YOU shouldn't have bred your boy to her girl! I am glad to hear you sell primarily on limited registration. All breeders should see a majority of their pups on limited (IMHO), but that is an individual choice.


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rwatsonaz

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Reply with quote  #82 

 I believe that what you have said is as you put, is with the most positive intentions.  However, speaking from a technical perspective concerning your website let me be blunt.  My intent is to give constructive criticism it is a disaster and you should pull it down and place an “Under Construction” until you have something better.  You do not even include a mission statement, what are you about?  I speak from a professional point of view, that what you have here is nothing more than a conglomeration of miss information and miss leading advertising. A Fortune 150 company, in transportation, employs me in Information Technology, with certifications MCP, MSCE, MSCE+I, MCPD, CCNA I will site examples:

Von Schiedel's Sherman Tank
"Cowboy"
AKC# WS237472
D.O.B.10/11/07
Height 36"
Weight 335
#      you have advertised that Cowboy is 12lbs heavier than the world record

I would call Guinness if I were you.

    Zorba is An English Mastiff

The English Mastiff is a large breed with an excellent reputation from those who know of them. Many people are not familiar with the Mastiff breed, until they read about one of them being in the Guinness Book of World Records. Zorba holds the all-time Guinness World Record for the largest dog of all time at 343 lb. (156 kg). He was also measured from nose to tip of the tail at 8 feet and 3 inches (251 cm) and 37 inches at the shoulder. He was 8 years old at the time of the measurements, which was November 1989.

  Second:

 

This is a beautiful animal, I would be proud to have him in my home, I will ask again, would you please list the certification for his Service Badge.  This is something that if I had that Cert, I would list it.  What type of service dog is Cowboy? Again, I ask it, I may be interested in following your path.  I am working with various groups both National and local to put into legislation having this type of badge on a dog without the certification is a crime.  It is unfortunate that many people take advantage of this and make it so complicated for individuals where there is a true need.  Please show your certification for this wonderful animal to wear this badge.   If you do not have a Cert, you could be possibly breaking the law in your state and county, I would check. That is your responsibility not mine, be a more responsible dog owner and representative of Mastiff’s

Third: On your website, you promote your  Training.  Could you elaborate on how your training is done, if you indeed list the dogs or puppies as “trained” then a reasonable individual would presume that you are indeed or someone in your family is a Certified Trainer.   What is your background?  Have you gone through CGC program with any of your dogs?  I do not see that as listed.

Individuals that do supplement their income by breeding Mastiffs that do professionally show dogs and some that do show as a sport.  I have rescued two English Mastiff’s and purchased two, all of them have been through the full gamut of training from Certified Trainers, does that make me a trainer?  Nope, what it does do is give me an edge on looking at those individuals that may present themselves as Certified Trainers, and your website gives me the impression that you are indeed a Certified Trainer, are you?  You charge extra for it.

 

Fourth:

Please check these sites as an example as what can be done with simple web programs, they are not elaborate or intricate and you can do them in your spare time.

http://www.rockportmastiffs.com/

http://beowulfmastiffs.com/

http://www.midwestmastiffs.com/

     http://www.mountaintopmastiffs.com/

 

 The Above sites are strictly meant as an illustration of a good website design.

The dogs that I have purchased one are 2nd generation Gropetti and the other is 2nd generation Lazy D (thank you Molli).  100% show quality.   My intention was not to show, fact I know that one is in heaven right now and the other is in the back yard enjoying the morning sun.  I believe that your intentions are true, to have a good healthy line of Mastiffs

In conclusion, I have found that this board as many others does to some extent have a clique of people. Ya know what, that is life (in reference to your high school drama quote) so grow up.   I do not have the knowledge concerning showing or breeding that the professionals do here.  Some of the individuals I pay attention to, and honestly some of them are full of the stuff I pick up in the back yard after my dogs have eaten.  Nobody has all the answers and the answers that I am given from people I do checking on my own.  There is no gospel here.

 What has me in an uproar is that as much as I want to believe you, your representation (your website) forces me to only one conclusion and that your in it for the money not the breed and that is my opinion and does not represent anyone on this Forum or its owner.  I have attempted to offer you positive suggestions; it is my sole intent that you receive them as such.

 

You quote Proverbs 6: 16-19 & Ephesians 4:25, may I remind you of Job 31:5 and Proverbs 11:2


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Teresa

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Reply with quote  #83 
Nicely said Rick, but there's one area I'll respectfully disagree with you. I do not think all service dogs must be trained through professional trainers. It would force up the cost of such a dog unrealisticly. Also, some disease states aren't your easy to train for disease states. For example, not all dogs react to epilepsy. Often a seizure alert dog just has a talent for it. They just "get it" and both alert AND helps the epileptic recover after a seizure (during the post-ictal phase, a dog can really help the epileptic recover). The other area I'm intrigued by is the PTSD dogs (doctors are involved in that process). Finally, there's that wonderful case where a pet finds Itself self fulfilling the role of a service dog when it was not a planned thing. I will have to tell you that story (one of my puppy buyers). It will warm your heart for sure! I just think we need to be very careful about blocking the legitimate use of service dogs with too many laws and regulations.

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Teresa

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Reply with quote  #84 

And, though I don't know if Rick has research the breeders he posted, I would like to remind everyone that just because someone has a "perty" website, it does NOT make them a great breeder. The best way to find out for sure if a breeder is on the same page you are is to talk to them and ask LOTS of questions!!


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rwatsonaz

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Reply with quote  #85 

Ok, in response yes and no Teresa, this is a quick Google search and I guess if you want to shop prices range from $19.95 to $69.95 for “Service Dog” certification.   So let us rock and roll….

http://www.abetterpet.com/abetterpet2/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/Service-Dog-Law-Change-2011.pdf  US Department of Justice, Americans with Disabilities ACT

http://governor.state.tx.us/disabilities/resources/assistance_animals/

Notice that the key in Texas is that a "State Employee" may obtain paid leave to attend a training program to familiarize themselves with assistance dogs.

http://www.azsos.gov/public_services/chapter_laws/2002/45th_Legislature_2nd_Regular_Session/CH_302.pdf  Specifically Page 4 of H.B. 2036 State of Arizona item #5 lists definition of Service Animal and specifically mentions has completed a formal training program.  I do not believe this is a mail order program.

http://www.ada.gov/qasrvc.htm   this just shows how vague the overall definition of what a Service Dog actually is.  The ADA defines a service animal as any guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to provide assistance to an individual with a disability. If they meet this definition, animals are considered service animals under the ADA regardless of whether they have been licensed or certified by a state or local government. 

The American Heritage Dictionary defines a Service Dog as and I quote " A dog that has been specifically trained to assist a disabled person with certain daily tasks, such as picking up an object"  Give me a shock collar and I can have a dog drive me to work.

Here is my favorite:   https://www.usarplus.com/Packages.asp  

Go ahead and register, why you can choose what level you want your "Service" Dog to be, I like the Diamond Package cause I get Two Years of Service Animal & Service Animal Handler ID Cards.  

http://www.servicedogcentral.org/content/changes

How was the definition of "service animal" changed July 23, 2010?

 

On July 23, 2010, Attorney General Eric Holder signed final regulations revising the Department’s ADA regulations, including a revised definition of “service animal.” This final rule was published in the Federal Register September 15, 2010, and the effective date is six months after that publication.

 

Effective March 15, 2011, “Service animal means any dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability, including a physical, sensory, psychiatric, intellectual, or other mental disability. Other species of animals, whether wild or domestic, trained or untrained, are not service animals for the purposes of this definition. The work or tasks performed by a service animal must be directly related to the handler´s disability. Examples of work or tasks include, but are not limited to, assisting individuals who are blind or have low vision with navigation and other tasks, alerting individuals who are deaf or hard of hearing to the presence of people or sounds, providing non-violent protection or rescue work, pulling a wheelchair, assisting an individual during a seizure, alerting individuals to the presence of allergens, retrieving items such as medicine or the telephone, providing physical support and assistance with balance and stability to individuals with mobility disabilities, and helping persons with psychiatric and neurological disabilities by preventing or interrupting impulsive or destructive behaviors. The crime deterrent effects of an animal´s presence and the provision of emotional support, well-being, comfort, or companionship do not constitute work or tasks for the purposes of this definition.”

 

Key changes include the following:

 1. Only dogs will be recognized as service animals.

 2. Service animals are required to be leashed or harnessed except when performing work or tasks where such tethering would interfere with the dog's ability to perform.

 3. Service animals are exempt from breed bans as well as size and weight limitations.

 4. Though not considered service animals, businesses are generally required to accommodate the use of miniature horses under specific conditions.

 Until the effective date, existing service animals of all species will continue to be covered under the ADA regulations.

Existing policies that were clarified or formalized include the following:

 1. Dogs whose sole function is “the provision of emotional support, well-being, comfort, or companionship” are not considered service dogs under the ADA.

 2. The use of service dogs for psychiatric and neurological disabilities is explicitly protected under the ADA.

 3. “The crime deterrent effects of an animal's presence” do not qualify that animal as a service animal and “an animal individually trained to provide aggressive protection, such as an attack dog, is not appropriately considered a service animal

http://www.ada.gov/regs2010/titleII_2010/reg2_2010.html     Section 35.136 Service animals (I will save anyone from reading the whole thing.

Section 35.136 Service Animals, I am quoting directly

 "Training requirement. Certain commenters recommended the adoption of formal training requirements for service animals. The Department has rejected this approach and will not impose any type of formal training requirements or certification process, but will continue to require that service animals be individually trained to do work or perform tasks for the benefit of an individual with a disability. While some groups have urged the Department to modify this position, the Department has determined that such a modification would not serve the full array of individuals with disabilities who use service animals, since individuals with disabilities may be capable of training, and some have trained, their service animal to perform tasks or do work to accommodate their disability. A training and certification requirement would increase the expense of acquiring a service animal and might limit access to service animals for individuals with limited financial resources.

 

Some commenters proposed specific behavior or training standards for service animals, arguing that without such standards, the public has no way to differentiate between untrained pets and service animals. Many of the suggested behavior or training standards were lengthy and detailed. The Department believes that this rule addresses service animal behavior sufficiently by including provisions that address the obligations of the service animal user and the circumstances under which a service animal may be excluded, such as the requirements that an animal be housebroken and under the control of its handler."

 

The bottom line as I see it, and I am not a lawyer, is that you don't really need to go through some training program....what a shame.

 

So to the owner of VonSchiedelEnglishMastiff  I apologize formally and publicly.. you do not have to prove a darn thing

 

As always,

Peace


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Teresa

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Reply with quote  #86 

No, you are actually right Rick. She doesn't, BUT I agree with you that any dog used as a Service Dog be a LEGITIMATE SD. The hope is that dogs that wear that SD vest are well trained and do their job AND show how valuable a service dog can be. It really wouldn't be too cool to have a misbehaved service dog.


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Crossroads

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Reply with quote  #87 
Rick and Teresa,

These are the exact words taken from the Von Scheidel web site.  They are on her "Trained Adults Available" page.

"Note to Viewers;  I do not claim to have service certified dogs with a piece of paper saying they went through courses...........They don't need a piece of paper to save my life as they have on many occasions........"

I left out the words where she talks about her various illnesses as I didn't think they were pertinent to this conversation. The whole quote can be seen on her site.  I can't imagine why her dogs would be wearing that vest or what the tag in the plastic window says. 

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rwatsonaz

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Reply with quote  #88 
I am done with this thread--->  Caveat Emptor
 
Peace

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Reply with quote  #89 

I think that pretty much sums it up!


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mtmastiffs

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Reply with quote  #90 

Christina Jones could you then explain why you just allowed a man who bought a female in heat and called all the mastiff breeders in Ohio to find someone with a stud to use on this girl because he bought her as a financial investment and YOU are allowing him to breed to your boy.  Who in the hell does that.  So don't come on here and throw yourself out there as some wonderful person because you are a horrible person and breeder to do this to that poor girl.


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